Welcome to The Corner Box, where your hosts, David Hedgecock, and John Barber, lean into their decades of comic book industry experience, writing, drawing, editing, and publishing. They'll talk to fellow professionals, deep dive into influential, and overlooked works, and analyze the state of the art, and business of comics, and pop culture. Thanks for joining us on The Corner Box.

[00:28] David Hedgecock: Hi, everybody. Welcome back to The Corner Box. I'm here, as always, David Hedgecock, the host with the most, and with me, as usual, is

[00:38] “John Barber”: Ho, ho, ho. John Barber.

[00:40] David: No, no, just kidding. That wasn't really John. I know, I fooled you listeners, but it wasn't really John. That was just me doing an impression of John. No, John's not here. John's on vacation, or expatriating to Mexico, potentially. Not really sure, but with me, instead, is editor-in-chief of Fun Time Go!, Chase Marotz.

[01:01] Chase Marotz: Good to be here.

[01:02] David: Nice to have you back on the show, man. Actually, I think the last time you were on the show, I wasn't on the show.

[01:06] Chase: I think that's true.

[01:07] David: You're the substitute teacher of The Corner Box.

[01:10] Chase: Happy to fill in. I feel like, sometimes—[…] coming up, but there were two substitute teachers that taught on the regular, at my junior high, especially, that everyone loved, dude. They were way more popular than the teachers they were filling in for.

[01:24] David: I did not have that. I had a substitute teacher when I was in grade school, who was the only regular. Her name was Mrs. Scow, and she was a very overweight older lady, probably a year away from having one of those little motor scooters--the little wheelchair scooters--a Rascal--but wasn't using it, and everybody called her Mrs. Cow, but she never knew that we were calling her Mrs. Cow, because it sounded the same as Mrs. Scow. So, that's who I had. She wasn't very cool. Although, I will say that I got in a fight one time, and she was the substitute teacher, and she just let the fight go. That was one of the only fights I ever won, in my whole life. So, I was glad that she let it go.

[02:12] Chase: So, she was cool after all.

[02:14] David: So, she was cool for that, but we're not here for that, Chase. We're here to talk about comic books, and comic book-related things, but I feel like we should talk about some of your credentials, man. Did we do that for you, last time? We should do a little bit about who Chase Marotz is.

[02:28] Chase: Yeah, we can do a little bit about who I am.

[02:30] David: What was the comic book or thing that turned you from a casual consumer of comic books to a fanatic? Did a flip switch, or was it a--?

[02:43] Chase: It was definitely a flip switch, and the flip switch was, I checked out The Dark Knight Returns from the Public Library in Idaho Falls, when I was 11, which--I definitely should not have been reading that book at 11, but my mom thought that, because it had Batman on it, everything was fine, and by the end of that volume, I didn't know what to do with myself. I was just like, “comics are just it.” 

[03:04] David: Was that the first comic you read? Had you not read anything before it?

[03:06] Chase: It wasn’t the first comic I read. The first comic I ever bought was Amazing Spider-Man #400 off the spinner rack at B. Dalton Books, and I liked it. I liked Spider-Man, and stuff, but I’d pick up comics in the line at Freddy's, back when they sold comics at Freddy's, when I was with my mom. After Dark Knight Returns, that was when I made my parents start driving me places, specifically to get comics, instead of just buying comics when they were around.

[03:30] David: Yeah. That's a good one, man. That one rocks your boat. That one still rocks my boat. I still read that book. I swear, I read that book at least once a year, still.

[03:37] Chase: I was this little Methodist kid, growing up in this really well-heeled town in Idaho, and you get to Issue #3, where she has the Swastikas on her boobs, and stuff. I’m like, “what the f*ck is this?” I was just not prepared for any of it. It was great.

[03:52] David: Yeah, it does explain a lot about you. Chase, Con season is upon us.

[03:59] Chase: WonderCon just finished.

[04:01] David: Yeah, as we're recording this. I think it just was this past weekend, right?

[04:06] Chase: I think so.

[04:07] David: I can barely keep up. Not that it ever truly ends, but it seems to get into full force here pretty soon. So, we thought we would regale the listeners with our Con experiences, and maybe run through what we think is proper etiquette, not only from the fan side of things, but from the professional side of things—us being professionals.

[04:28] Chase: Think of it as a handy audio guidebook--tips, tricks, and inside scoops from two gentlemen who've lived through many of them, and we'll even remember parts of them.

[04:40] David: Speak for yourself. What we didn't do is figure out how we're going to start this. So, how do you want to handle this, Chase? Should we start from the fan side first, or should we start from the professional side? What do you think?

[04:54] Chase: I think we could start from the fan side, just because I went to many different Cons as a fan, before I ever was professional, and then finally had the experience of, last year, I only had one professional thing to do at SDCC. So, I went as a fan, for the first time in very many years, and it was a delight.

[05:10] David: Do you remember what your first Comic Convention was?

[05:12] Chase: Yeah, it was Emerald City. I started going to Emerald City when I was in college, because I went to University of Washington.

[05:18] David: Oh. Didn't you do some schooling in New York, as well?

[05:21] Chase: I got my master’s degree in New York.

[05:23] David: Oh, that was your master’s. Okay.

[05:24] Chase: Yeah, but I got my Undergrad at UW.

[05:26] David: Your first Emerald City Con, did you go there for a specific person, or were you there just to do the thing?

[05:31] Chase: I was just there to do the thing, and it still haunts me, because this must have been probably pretty close to 20 years now. I don't remember what the first year was, but I do remember Tim Sale was doing head sketches for $50 a shot, and I did not get one, because I was a broke college student, but they looked really good, and his list wasn't full, and Bill Sienkiewicz, at this point, was down in the basement with the other artists. He didn't have his whole big booth, yet, and he did not seem like a gregarious fellow, at all, down there. No, it was fun. It was great. I got a bunch of back issues, and just got a bunch of free signatures on stuff, because I didn't have much money. It was a lovely time.

[06:07] David: I know my first comic convention was--I was just out of high school, I think, and I’d just moved down to San Diego, for college. So, I grew up in a tiny little town. There was no way I was getting to a Convention, but now that I lived in San Diego, I went to the granddaddy of all of them. Even in the mid-90s, San Diego ComiCon was still one of the biggest. Blown up in the crazy way it blew up in the mid-2000s, but I think it was still the biggest. Anyway. It was the height of the Image popularity. Me and my brother who's much younger than me, went to San Diego ComiCon, because we were going to go get signatures of all the Image guys, and their new books, and some of the books, I don't even think all the books were out yet, or maybe they were out. You couldn’t get all of them, or something. I don't know. Really what happened was, we stood in line for 3 hours to get Rob Liefeld's signature, and when we got up to him, to get his signature, he wasn't even paying attention. He was actually yelling at somebody else. So, it was not any interaction, whatsoever. Through no fault of his own, really. We just happened to be next in line when stuff happened. It was not super fun, but we did see the Spawn mobile.

[07:12] Chase: That’s cool.

[07:13] David: For the first Con I've ever been to, to be the biggest one, I was like, “wow, this is mind-blowing.” Even back then, it was sensory overload.

[07:22] Chase: Yeah, I didn't do my first San Diego until I was 30, and even then, it was too much. Feels you've departed reality and have left it behind for the four days that you're there.

[07:32] David: A year or two ago, I figured out, from that first ComiCon, I didn't miss one until during the lockdown. So, I did 30 years in a row. I didn't miss one. You’d think I have more memories and experiences, but I don't remember any of it. San Diego ComiCon is such a sensory overload. There’s so much happening everywhere, all at once, and engaging every sense you have--sight, sound, touch, smell--it's all just bombarding you. I think I get like a deer in the headlights. I have no idea what's going on. I can barely complete a thought when I'm at San Diego ComiCon. So, I think it's some trauma thing. I can't remember stuff. What was the first rule of Con fandom that you learned, as you were going to shows? Either somebody told you, “Hey, don't do that,” or you were like, “Oh, my God. I wish they weren't doing that.”

[08:25] Chase: It's a broad one, but I think it's important to remember that, as much as a fan that you want to do everything, and see everything, and meet everyone, there's 100,000 other people in that room that want the same thing you do. So, I think be cognizant of other people's space around you. Be cognizant of stopping in front of stuff, and backing up. I think spatial awareness is something that could make ComiCons function so much better. If people--if they want to take a picture of something, wonderful, but instead of stopping in the middle of a busy throughfare to just hold your phone up and take pictures of things, you can step to the side. You can check behind you before doing it. I've seen people rear-end each other, because someone stops abruptly in front of something they've seen, and they just back up, like crashes on the highway. So, that's a big one, I think.

[09:10] David: That's very good, especially in those more busy Cons. Again, San Diego does a pretty good job. They've widened the aisles every year.

[09:16] Chase: Yeah, true.

[09:18] David: And they do try, but there's still so many people, and the thing that drives me nuts, speaking of spatial awareness, is when people--their meeting point is the smack-center of two cross-sections of major traffic, and they’re like, “Let's meet in the middle there, where we can talk for a few minutes, and the five of us can figure out what we're going to do,” and it's like a block in an artery. It creates a massive heart attack. It's very frustrating. The thing that I discovered about spacial awareness, for me, myself--I do like to take photos of just fun stuff. What I figured out was--step to the side, get my camera ready--usually, it's just my phone—get my camera ready, get it out, get it prepped, get it ready to go, and then do whatever it is that I'm going to do, and not necessarily waiting for a free moment, for people to clear up, because that never happens.

[10:13] Chase: It's never going to happen, no.

[10:15] David: Just be prepared, so that when I am inconveniencing all the people around me, because I want to get that picture, which I think is fair, and it doesn't bother me when other people do it--just be quick as I can about it. Get the shot I want, and then get back out of the way. That's a very good one. What other fan notes, would you say? I mean, there's the obvious one of “take a shower,” and stuff, but I feel like we're experiencing that less and less, these days.

[10:41] Chase: Yeah, it's also a problem, but I feel like we can drill down in this. I guess, as a fan, please try and recognize the humanity of the people you are approaching, and talking to, whether that is creators, whether that is somebody ringing you up at the register, whether that is editorial. Having been on the other side of, being a comic editor, working at a booth, if there's a line of people, and I'm running the register, I can't look at your portfolio right then, and I've had people get angry, because I can't give them the attention to look at their portfolio, without recognizing that there's a lot of things going on around them, and I'm servicing people who aren't them. None of that reaction, to me not dealing with them right then, makes me want to have a working relationship with them.

I think back, and this is a personal anecdote—Last year, I was in Simon Bisley's line, because I love Simon Bisley, and somebody asked Simon Bisley for a quick Dredd sketch, which Simon, being a fantastic gentleman, happily obliged, but people in line saw that, and everyone started asking for it, and the asks became progressively more and more involved, to where the person right in front of me in line—and Simon is visibly frustrated, by this point. People are asking for all sorts of shit--and this guy asked him for a topless woman with a battle axe, and Simon did it for him, but you could tell, he just was not prepared to do all this shit for free, and didn't know how to tell a fan “No,” because you don't want to see everybody else do it. Hot blast you online, like “Simon Bisley’s such a piece of shit. He did this for everybody else,” but I also really wanted my Dredd head sketch.

So, what I did is, I had a $50 in my wallet, I took it out, I said, “Simon, this is for a few pints on me, but without having to be around me. Would you draw me a Dredd head sketch?” And he was so f*cking happy to just get that $50 that I spend the next hour and a half hanging out with Simon Bisley, while he drew me this beautiful Dredd sketch. $50 was a steal for what he ended up drawing me, but he's a hoot and a holler. He was introducing me to people. At one point, he pulled all of the money out of his pocket, and had me count it for him, while he was drawing, because he wanted to know how much money he had, and then once he established that, he had me go get him coffee. So, I did a little coffee run for him, and brought him back a coffee, and I got a brilliant head sketch, and a great story out of it.

[12:48] David: Did he know you worked in comics, at any point?

[12:50] Chase: No.

[12:51] David: So, you're this random guy, for him?

[12:54] Chase: Yeah.

[12:55] David: That's hilarious.

[12:56] Chase: But just the ability to read the room, and realize, maybe it is a pain in the ass to draw 10 things for free when you have a long line, if you give people a little courtesy, or ask if they can be paid for remarks, or anything, I think there is a desire, because there's so much stuff to be spent on, to try and get anything you can for free, but it goes a long way to recognize that this is work for these people, this is a talent that they've cultivated, and it is worth something, especially because I think a lot of creators have been burned. I mean, you remember the Peach Momoko incident, where she was giving away affordable sketches, and all of these speculators just rushed her booth, and she had to cancel it. I think that there's a habit, on the part of some fans, to try and get everything they can for free, but if you think it's worth something, you should treat it like it's worth something.

[13:39] David: Yeah, the “is this free?” thing. You get a lot of that from the younger crowd. I think that, for me, around that, when I'm being just a fan, I have a list of two or three things that--I know who's going to be at the show. For me, in particular, there's probably somebody at the show that I really want to meet, and have them do something for me, potentially, and if I can't set it up ahead of time, I'm prepared, again, to go to their booth, sit as long as I need to sit, ask for what I want, be willing to pay for it. I guess, as a fan--fans need to realize that the gift is that they're there, period.

[14:24] Chase: Yeah.

[14:25] David: The gift is the ability to get a chance to see and/or shake the hand, or meet the people that are making stuff that you really enjoy. That's the gift, and anything above and beyond that can be a gift, but sometimes it's a transaction, and you just have to be aware of which one that is.

[14:41] Chase: Right. Well, and again, it goes back to reading the room. An artist is much more, I think, in my experience, willing to accommodate a remark, or a quick sketch, or something, if they're not that busy. If you're #50 in a line of 100, and you're asking someone to draw you shit, they're not going to want to do it. They're there for an hour, or two hours, max. I mean, you’ve probably seen this, having worked at the IDW booth. Watching the level of stuff that people ask Kevin Eastman for, even with the crowd around him, and Kevin is such a sweetheart that he'll try and accommodate everybody, but he's got an hour and a half slot, and there are people who show up with 50 items, and ask him for sketches, and stuff, and thankfully, I think, he has handlers who can say no for people, because he doesn't want to, but that mentality is staggering, for me, like you’re going to really try and treat this person like they're there for you, when there's a bunch of other people in line with you.

[15:27] David: Yeah, it is shocking when it happens, to me. I guess there's a certain—you’ve got to take your shot, but yeah. That’s a tough one. The other thing that's frustrating, and you mentioned it, is the speculators, or the flippers, that get in there, and they're there to do exactly what I think you're not supposed to do, which is try to find something as cheap as you possibly can, and then flip it for more.

[15:50] Chase: Yeah.

[15:51] David: There's a certain point at which that's gross. When you drop 50 issues of a book in front of somebody, or copies of the exact same thing in front of somebody. […] The window already-- Yeah, it's like, “Oh, yeah. You're a real big fan.”

[16:09] Chase: And I don't want this to turn into ragging on the fans, because I think, obviously, comics is a great job, and it is by the continuing engagement of fans wanting to spend money on it that we get to have this great position, where we work, but I think, yeah, there's a difference of being “fans shouldn't ask for anything” versus “read the room, a little bit,” and this is a true story. This is a true incident, and again, for a Kevin Eastman line--nicest guy in comics. I watched some fanboy in his 40s muscle past a dad pushing a stroller, to the point where the guy in the stroller almost went over, so he could get a better spot in the Kevin Eastman line, ahead of this father who was there with his kids, and I'm like, “that's f*cking crazy. Why would you do that? Don’t love the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles so much that you can't forget that you're a human animal, or there are children around you that shouldn't be injured.” It's all I'm asking. I know that’s maybe a high bar.

[16:57] David: You’re asking a lot. In general, though, from the professional side of things, speaking, fans, for the most part--it's one of those things, that one bad apple spoils the bunch. One of my biggest, most important pieces of advice--as we were talking, it came up to me--for any Con-goer, fans or professionals--an extra pair of socks, and a good pair of shoes.

[17:23] Chase: Yes. 100%, dude. So necessary. Yeah. Put it in the backpack. 

[17:28] David: Man, I'm telling you--the good pair of shoes is obvious. Have a really nice, comfortable pair of walking shoes, because you're going to be walking, buddy, and standing, a lot. You don't even realize how much you're walking, or standing around, because you're swimming in comic book stuff, and Convention stuff. You're getting tired when you don't even realize it, but then when it hits you, it's just like, “oh, man.” It hits you like a wall of bricks. So, that one seems obvious, but when I learned “bring an extra pair of socks,” and around midday, when you're just starting to feel a little tired, you bust those fresh socks out and put those things on--Don't do it inside the Convention. Go outside to do that--but man, putting on that new fresh pair of socks--Oh, my God. It makes all the difference in the world, man. It really does, somehow, reinvigorate me, every time I do it. It’s like magic.

[18:15] Chase: Whether you’re a fan or pro, the nicest thing you can do for yourself is recognize the amount of physical labor you're actually putting in. There are days--I hit 30,000 steps in a day once, or more. You're going to be walking all around that Convention Center, and you're going to be walking out, doing stuff. So, I think, yeah, taking care to hydrate, wear comfortable shoes--even if they're not fashionable--and yeah, have that extra pair of socks. Don’t skip lunch. You’re doing a lot of walking. Your body needs--unless you're going to get the Convention Center food. Then skip that lunch, dude. The Convention Center nachos are not going to be the help you think they are.

[18:51] David: Yeah, you’ve got to eat real food. Grab a salad, or something. I always try to grab a salad. I always try to grab a piece of fruit. I always pack an energy bar with me, in my backpack. I only ever carry a backpack. I don't do anything more than a backpack, and because books are heavy, I try to make sure that I have a list of wants, and that list is not so big that I'm carrying around 30 lbs. of books by the end of the day. I do try to limit my list to “okay, that's probably going to be about 10 lbs. worth of books,” and 10 lbs. is a lot after walking for 15,000 steps, and trying to avoid people the whole time.

[19:27] Chase: I am bad at that. I'm historically bad at the limiting. I push my backpack to the edge, and I'm always upset by the end of the day.

[19:35] David: Yeah. Not me. I never over-stuff it, because it's too much.

[19:38] Chase: There have been a few Convention Centers, where I brought artists editions to get signed, and when you commit to carrying around an artist edition for a whole f*cking day, or two of them, you're really in it.

[19:46] David: I would love to have some of my artist editions signed, but it's too much. I'm not going to do it.

[19:51] Chase: It was so worth it, dude. Last year, I paid $300 for the Bill Sienkiewicz color remark, inside my Bill Sienkiewicz artist edition. Such a steal, dude. He did such a good job. He did a beautiful Kingpin. I thought he was going to do color pencil, or something. This guy--because there was a, I think, $150 black and white tier, or a $300 color tier, I was like, “well, I'm going to treat myself. I want the color tier.” He busts out the watercolors, and it's water coloring there, and has colored pencil, he's touching it with his fingers to make it all Bill Sienkiewicz-y, and it was a joy to watch, and a joy to have, and for $300, it's a lot of money, but that's the thing--that memory and that piece of art, that's well worth that.

[20:32] David: It seems to me like Sienkiewicz has been around forever. I see his stuff lately, and I'm like, “man, is he somehow getting better, still?”

[20:40] Chase: He’s really good at drawing.

[20:42] David: He's so good. As we're talking, the actor, Val Kilmer, passed away recently, just in the last few days, and he posted a piece of Val Kilmer--I think he just did it--and it's Val Kilmer as Doc Holliday, and it's a worms-eye shot. So, the camera's low, looking up at Val Kilmer. I think he's holding a gun, and my God, it is so good. It's just like, “man, did he just bust that out, just in a couple of days?” and it looks like a $20,000 painting.

[21:14] Chase: Having seen the Kingpin he drew me, in the 10 minutes it took him to draw it, it's wild, and what's so impressive about his art, I think--having watched him do it--when he starts doing it, it really looks like nothing. It really looks like, you're like, “I don't know how he's going to pull this one out,” and then he does little things, and all of a sudden, just busts the whole thing together, like “holy shit. That's just cool.”

[21:33] David: That's fun.

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[22:21] David: As a fan, do you go to the other stuff, like the programming?

[22:24] Chase: No. So, naturally--and this is just a shortcoming with me, as a person--I have trouble sitting still and listening to stuff that I'm not directly involved in. So, I love working, and sitting at my desk, and doing things, but if I have to sit in a room with other people, and just consume, it’s very hard for my limited attention span, and this is also why I'm not great at going to movies, in the theater.

[22:46] David: I didn't know this about you.

[22:48] Chase: Yeah. Concerts, you can make an exception for, because concerts, you're allowed to move around, run into people, and go back and forth, and it's a physical experience, but sitting still and listening--I've never been great at that. So, I don't do any programming, no.

[23:02] David: I'm not into the programming, either. I was hoping that you would have some good things to say about how to handle programming.

[23:08] Chase: I know people who really like the programming, and I think, yeah, if that's your thing, first looks at stuff is cool, and […]--I don't know. I just feel like there's so much going on at ComiCon. I get a little FOMO. The idea of standing in line for 2 hours, not on the floor, I feel like I'm just wasting all my floor time, that I could be running around, like a maniac, and just seeing everything, but that's just how I do shows. There's no right way, or wrong way, to do a show, unless the way you want to do a show is be an asshole, as far as I'm concerned. That's the only wrong way to do it.

[23:37] David: I agree. No, that's a good rule. I agree. On the professional side, what are some things that you look for, from your fellow professionals, when they're coming up to you? You've been an editor in your comic book career, pretty much, the whole time of your comic book career. So, what does that look like, for you, when other professionals are trying to engage with you, and what do you look for, what do you hope for, when you engage with fellow professionals?

[24:03] Chase: Not dissimilar to fans, I think there's a reading-the-room element, because you obviously, ComiCon, as an editor, it's a working show. We're there to talk work, but there are occasions where I've had professionals approach me, where I'm either in an active conversation with someone else that I've already been involved in, or actually doing work on the IDW floor, and they want to talk about work, that instant. That's not a great way to make me want to work with you. If you want to say hello, if you want to make plans to talk for later, wonderful, but I think, without naming names, and probably this doesn't happen, but I think there are certain pro’s I’ve bumped into, where they're so focused on work they're trying to get, they fail to realize that maybe you’re busy, or maybe you're already talking to somebody who might deserve your attention, at that point in time.

[24:45] David: For me, the interruptions are frustrating, but sometimes, understandable, but the thing that frustrates me is when someone is not cognizant of the amount of time they're taking from me. Like, “hey, buddy. I don't have 20 minutes to talk right now. I have 5, and I'm happy to give you 5, but then we have to move on, because there's 100 more people that would also like 5 minutes of my time.” This is speaking as an editor, as well, largely. I don't know if this is necessarily the same when you're on the other side of the professional table, as a freelancer, or creative talent. I think it's a little different for them, but having the ability to have the interaction, and then be able to move on to the next thing, is really important, because of how much I have to do, and how many people that I have to engage with. So, I'll get creators, sometimes, who don't understand that, and they want to take all of my time, and when I see them, I hide.

[25:49] Chase: I've set up way more actual work options with a pleasant 5-minute conversation not about work, and then a follow-up e-mail the next week, when we're all back at it. I was doing--Star Trek, especially--you have people, it's like, “what’s the next year of Star Trek looking like? Can I get on the cover?” It’s like, “I don't f*cking know. I'm trying to run the register here at ComiCon. I don't know what to tell you right now. These are questions that I could answer if you would send them an e-mail, but here in the […] of ComiCon is not maybe--” I don't know if all editors do this, but I am very committed, as an editor to, if somebody does leave me with something, be it a leave-behind package, recent work, whatever, I do set that aside, and I look at all of it, even if it's from somebody non-established.

[26:26] David: Oh, I do the same. My rule for--how I would love to see other professionals--I guess, specifically editors--but other professionals conduct themselves, is the way I try to conduct myself--I tell myself this, literally as I'm having to interact with somebody--this is running through my head the whole time--and I'm not even joking--It's the thought that “you never know where you're meeting somebody in their journey--on their way up, or on their way down--So, treat them, accordingly. Treat them as if they're on their way up.” I've seen samples of people who were not ready, were not good, but I treated them with respect, and I tried to be kind, and I tried to be honest. Five years later, they're Jim Lee. It's like, “whoa, I'm glad that I took the time to remember to be kind, and to be professional, and to be giving of the time when I was able to,” because you just never know who is really hungry, and who is going to do the thing.

[27:27] Chase: Obviously, I want to give time to everybody, but as you said, it's just such a hectic battleground that it's tough, and yeah, I think, you don't want to be one of those professionals--because I think we all have them. I certainly hope I'm not one of those for anybody, but you never know--where, if somebody sees you coming down the Con floor, you avoid them, because you don't have 20 minutes, or 1/2 hour, or you have something you're rushing to. There's some people that it's hard to just have a casual “hello” with, and a lot of ComiCon interactions are, for good or ill--there are people I adore, who we’ll maybe see each other for 5 minutes during the Convention, and it's a tragedy, because you look forward to seeing certain people, for the entire year, that maybe you don't get to see, because you don’t live in the same town, they come in, and sometimes, schedules just don't align, and that's just the reality of the beast you're dealing with.

[28:14] David: An example of what I was just saying just came up--just in this last week, I was picking up some comics off of eBay, some ratty old comic books--I don't remember what it was--What was it? It was something very lame--Anyway, I wish I could remember, because it’d be better for the anecdote, but I was picking up some comic books online the other day. The person I was buying it from texted me through the eBay app, and was like, “hey are you the David Hedgecock that used to work at IDW?” or he said, “are you the David Hedgecock that's an editor?” and I thought, for a minute, maybe I don't want to do this on the eBay app, but I was like “who cares?” and like, “yeah, that's me. You got it,” and he's like, “oh, man. I just want to tell you, I really appreciate how kind you were, and how you gave me some great advice, and you didn't just brush me off, and I came back to you another time, and you were just really generous, and just, thanks a lot. I really appreciated that,” and I said, “Oh, well, I'm so glad that you had a positive interaction with me,” because I don't remember him, of course. He was one of probably several dozen people, in that day alone, that I was looking at artist portfolios, but he had a positive interaction, and he remembered it as something, to the point where, who knows how many years later, he's talking to me about it.

So, it just reinforced what I already believe, and what I already know, is that if you treat people with kindness and respect--you have to remember, this comic book industry’s so small. It's such a small industry. There's not a lot of people--and it's doesn't harm or cost anything to be nice, or to be genuine, and kind, and professional. It costs nothing to do those things. So, just do them.

[29:51] Chase: Definitely. I mean, when I first started at IDW, I was an editorial assistant. There were several pro’s who were either completely dismissive of me, or in a couple of cases, just outright jerks, who as soon as I was an editor, were all of a sudden, very nice, when I was working on a book that they would have liked to work on. It's like, “you might not remember the editorial assistant that you just totally brushed off,” or I remember being that kid.

[30:16] David: If he remembers you. Yeah.

[30:18] Chase: Yeah. You never know.

[30:20] David: Like I said, you just never know where people are in their journey--on their way up, or on the way down. I think the better version of that, the more humane version of that, is to just be kind. That's my big one. That's my golden rule for interaction. I don't know that I always get it right. I'm sure that I haven't always gotten it right, but I like to think that, most of the time, I get right.

[30:42] Chase: I do the best I can, but even that's mediocre, at best. I do the best I can. I’m really trying.

[30:52] David: What other Con tidbits, or anecdotes, or rules do you have for us, Chase?

[30:58] Chase: BarCon is fun, but know your limits. If I could give anyone good BarCon advice, go home an hour before you want to. No one ever had a bad day the next day because they went home an hour early.

[31:11] David: Yeah, that's a good rule of thumb.

[31:13] Chase: And this is as a perpetual breaker of that rule, where like, “God, I wish I'd gone to bed an hour earlier last night, […] few drinks before.”

[31:21] David: Yeah, there's so many reasons for that. Just don't drink a lot, because you're going to be foolish, and as a fan, I'm not sure how much this rule really applies, because--I don't know--if you want to drink, and you're on vacation, go for it. You're probably just going to be late, going to the Convention the next day, but as a professional, that rule definitely applies, because A, you're not on the job, but you're on the job, and B, people that you don't know are watching, and C, you’ve got to work the next morning, really early, and by the way, you probably haven't had a day off in, at least, seven days, by this point, because you were preparing for the Convention, before you actually showed up to the Convention, and then you're working at the Convention, an 8-to-10-hour day. So, man, you’ve got to take care of yourself.

[32:06] Chase: I remember, my first San Diego ComiCon working for IDW, is back when Dirk Wood just had the open tab. So, everyone got a little too […]. I think I didn't get home until probably two or three that night, and I had to start my shift the next day. I was opening at the booth. So, I stumbled in at 3, woke up my wife, was just a mess, and then the next morning, I woke up, and I was running super late, and it was my first year. I'm like, “oh, God, I'm going to be so late. I want to impress these people, still. I feel like nobody knows me, yet.” I found an Uber driver who was this conservative conspiracy theorist crackpot, and that's all he wanted to talk about in the Uber ride, but he somehow got me from Golden Hill to Downtown, in record time, just weaving in and out of traffic. Got me as close to the Convention Center as he could. I was running as fast as I could, but I was hurting, and I bumped into someone who will remain unnamed, but they used to write a very prominent Hasbro property. I met them the night before, and they go to me, like “man, you look like shit.” I’m like, “I feel like shit,” and he goes, “I’ve got something for you,” and he gives me a candy that turned out to be a marijuana edible. So, I took the edible, because I thought it’d even me out, and then I get there, somebody leaves me upstairs, like “all right, you're going to be working at the John Lewis panel. You're going to be guarding the door, while people are in there and taking pictures of the event.”

So, I’m sitting there, John Lewis is speaking--civil rights legend John Lewis--as this candy starts to take effect. I was taking pictures, and it ends, and I'm about to slurk out, and I think it was Justin Eisinger, of all people, grabbed my arm, and was like, “no, no, we're not done yet,” and John Lewis, right at the end of the panel, because he had the signing right after, goes to this room, he’s like, “like I did in the 60s, with Dr Martin Luther King Jr, we're going to march. We're going to march from here, all the way down to my signing at the IDW booth, like it’s the 60s,” and everybody gets up, and get the line, and I’m right at the front, because Justin’s like, “you’ve got to do crowd control. So, you've got to push people out of the way, while John Lewis leads this crowd of revelers through the Convention Center.” I'm very elevated, by this point. I'm moving dudes in Iron Man suits out of the way, while civil rights legend, John Lewis, is right behind me, and we get him all the way down to the booth, and then I'm able to slurk away and take a break, but I guess the point of that story is, ComiCon can be magical. Let it be magical. Go home earlier than you think you should.

[34:21] David: I don't feel you had any penalty for staying up all night and rolling in as late as possible. John Lewis cosplaying as himself at the Convention--because you do realize, he was wearing the same thing that he wore when he did that walk. He was cosplaying himself.

[34:38] Chase: That's incredible. When I started at IDW, I'd come off of a very rough and lackluster year of my life, where I'd run into a wall on a lot of the dreams I thought I was going to do, and was a little rudderless, and then to have that moment, to be moving Iron Man out of the way, while John Lewis was right behind me, I’m like, “is this life? I did not expect to be here, but I'm glad I found myself here.”

[35:00] David: Man, John Lewis was definitely a highlight of any of my comic experiences. Meeting that man in person was--when I shook his hand, I literally felt--at the time I'm, of course, aware of John Lewis, as a human being, and I'm aware of the things that he was responsible for--John Lewis, massive influence, and one of the originators of the Martin Luther King social movement. So, I'm aware of these things--but then, he walks up, and I just happened to be there, and at the time, I think I was editor-in-chief. So, just by being that, I had the good fortune of being introduced to him, and I turned, and there he is, and he goes to shake my hand, and I'm being introduced to him, and just that interaction, unexpected--I just met this man for the first time--I turned around, and met this man for the first time, and his presence was so big, and I don't even know—the wisdom that man possessed was glowing out of him. It was an aura of just power and wisdom. It was palpable. You could see it and feel it, and hear it, and I didn't even know, in the moment that that was happening to me--The very next moment was when “this is John Lewis.” It was like, “who is this human being?” and then, “oh, it's John Lewis.” It was mind blowing. That guy was really incredibly impressive. That was one of the biggest highlights of any of the Conventions I've ever been at. What an incredible human being, and I love that I got to meet him, in person. What an unexpected treat that was. That was a great show.

[36:43] Chase: Yeah. A tip for fans, and pro’s, ComiCon can be magical. Appreciate the magic of this event. When else would you have a civil rights icon in the same building with the cast of Alien, in the same building as the surviving Power Ranger.

[37:00] David: Yeah, I guess that's a good rule. Be open to letting the magic happen. Be open to letting the experience wash over you, in some way.

[37:08] Chase: That sounds like a great meeting. I think it was the next year, I waited in line for 3 hours to meet Frank Miller, and he told me I looked like a skinhead, and asked if I wanted him to draw a burning cross in the front of my comic. I said I’d rather he draw Batman, and his handler’s like, “Frank's not drawing Batman.”

[37:22] David: Fantastic. You weren't able to get a Batman sketch from him, in person?

[37:27] Chase: No, but he did draw what he called a glowing cross in the front of my Dark Knight Returns gallery edition that I lugged all the way down there.

[37:35] David: That sounds great.

[37:36] Chase: Perhaps, less awe-inspiring than the John Lewis meeting, but especially given what we talked about at the top, what brought me into comics, I guess it feels full-circle, in a way.

[37:50] David: What else have you got for us, on this? I feel like, so far, we’ve got--wear good shoes, change your socks midway through, don't be a jerk, and let magic happen.

[38:00] Chase: Credit cards have f*cking ramifications, with the caveat that sometimes, you're going to find things that break your budget, but set a budget, and try to stick to it, dude. You don't want to be paying off your exclusives for the next two years. I speak as somebody who, my first couple ComiCons, did not take that advice to heart.

[38:17] David: I feel like you're speaking from experience here.

[38:18] Chase: Terrible decision.

[38:20] David: Yeah, I feel like you there. Sometimes, you're walking by that original art booth, and you're like, “what?” You’ve just got to do it. Sometimes, you’ve got to pull the trigger. I don’t know.

[38:28] Chase: Again, budgets are meant to be broken, but just do the best you can to hold to it. There's a lot of incidental costs you're not going to think about. There's food. There’s drinks. All of this stuff adds up. All of the non-comic parts about ComiCon, and just being in a different city, and having to exist there on a mini vacation is already so expensive, without all of the merchandise that ComiCon is pushing at you.

[38:50] David: Yeah. You only live once, Chase. I had one other thing I wanted to talk about today, though, Chase. I think I'll just save it for next time. For the listeners, so they are clued in, I recently fell into a rabbit hole. I discovered that Roger Corman had a comic book publishing line in the mid-90s, and published a decent chunk of books—15 or 16 books, over the course of a year and a half, two years. So, Roger Corman's Cosmic comics, and the book that they got out the most of, they got eight issues out of this, and it was called Death Race 2020 from Roger Corman's Cosmic Comics, and oh, boy, did I find a winner, and I can't wait to share it with all of you. Next time Chase is on the show, we'll have to pick that one up and do it. So, thanks, everybody, for coming. I hope you found our chat about Conventions helpful, in some way. Wear socks, be open for the magic moment, and watch your budget.

[39:47] Chase: Don't eat the Convention Center nachos, whatever you do.

[39:50] David: Do not eat the Convention Center nachos. All right. Thanks, everybody, for coming, and we'll see you next time on The Corner Box. Bye.

[39:58] Chase: Bye.

Thanks for joining us, and please subscribe, rate, and tell your friends about us. You can find updates, and links at www.thecornerbox.club, and we’ll be back next week, with more from David, and John, here at The Corner Box.